The Daw Poll - Redux

Audio, MIDI and other software, not including effects or instruments
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What is your preferred DAW (Digital Audio Workstation)

Cubase SE
5
1%
Cubase SL
2
0%
Cubase SX
49
6%
Digital Performer
170
21%
GarageBand
11
1%
Intuem
2
0%
Live
113
14%
Logic Pro
346
42%
Logic Express
29
4%
Melodyne
1
0%
Metro
1
0%
Nuendo
17
2%
Numerology
5
1%
Pro Tools
27
3%
Pro Tools LE
26
3%
Tracktion
22
3%
 
Total votes: 826

jaxx
Posts: 18
Joined: 18 Jul 2002, 14:40
Location: San Francisco, CA

Post by jaxx » 09 Sep 2004, 01:49

cerberus wrote:I think free upgrades are brilliant. When I get a free upgrade with bug fixes, enhancements and new features, such as Melodyne users get on a regular basis, I feel all glowing and good. And when the upgrade requires that I buy new hardware to use it (love ProTools), I feel like crap (hate Digidesign).

$199. for what used to cost over €1000. (but you didn't think was worth it or would already own) is somewhere in the middle. For someone who bought every Emagic plug and instrument in 2003, it is not a very good deal, we have been through this already. It's a dead horse now. Emagic took care of most people's hard luck stories. I'd prefer to see more software development and less hype next time around though. Someone has to pay for all that marketing effort. It's you.
jaxx wrote: ...in the environment that no application other than Max can do.
Me too, but perhaps comparing it to ProTools, or Live or even CubaseSX for audio is expecting too much from one app.


cerberus

Hmm, not sure if your feelings about this really click with the common reality of a capitalistic culture, but Free upgrades would eventually = out of business. I'm only guessing here, but I bet new customers are not as frequent as upgrade customers. In the case of $199, I really wanted these things, but they were simply too expensive at 2300 or whatever it originally cost.

I can't even imagine how I lived without the Evoc20. Truthfully, I knew about it, but had no idea how brilliant it was until Logic Pro.

So, bug fixes are great and no, it feels bad when I have to pay strictly for those (like with Cubase SX), but I do think that Emagic did/does a good job with frequent updates. Since version 3, there have been more than 5 updates per year at no charge. Often these updates add features and fix bugs, which is great.

I don't mind paying for a major whole number upgrade if there are lots of new things in the package. For _any_ software upgrade, I really think the price should be a balance between the new stuff that you get and the general affordability of it. With Logic 7, I've already seen Apple Loops, two new instruments. Those things look substantial to me. Now, its true.. I don't *have* to update if I don't want to. If i like what I have that's great. I can continue using it, but if I can afford it and there's something cool to buy, I'd like to have it, be it upgrade features or a totally new app, like Traktion, Live or SpongeFork.

Question really is.. what is too much? I don't know if I'd feel comfortable paying more than half the cost of a new copy of the app.

Sorry to go on about this, but right now, I'm trying to decide if Cubase SX 3 is worth the upgrade.

Is anyone here using it yet? (like as a beta tester)

is it worth it?

jaxx
Posts: 18
Joined: 18 Jul 2002, 14:40
Location: San Francisco, CA

Post by jaxx » 09 Sep 2004, 01:55

michael wrote:
jaxx wrote: As for the future of Logic, I have a lot of faith that Apple will guide the development of the UI in Logic. Apple is not perfect, but they seem to have a much better handle on UI design than Emagic does.

This is again where I don't quite think people understand, Apple bought Emagic because they like the product, and have left the Emagic staff pretty much alone about the GUI. Much better to use DP or SX if you don't like where Logic is right now, than to hope that Apple will "fix" Logic, from what I understand that's not how they're working with Emagic at all!
cheeky b wrote: I'm guessing that emagic would have upgraded ver 6 in pre apple days, but that's another topic.
I agree, I think in some ways the buyout isn't necessarily as beneficial as people would like to think. It will be if you're using FCP, but I'm not sure we'll see any major improvements of the Environment for example..... but like I said, from what I know, Apple is leaving the Emagic guys to their own devices....
Thats an amusing statement. Looked like the stuff they showed at NAMM looked a lot more Apple like than previous Logic versions..

Hey, also speaking about the Logic 6 upgrade, didn't you like Space Designer? I thought that was a pretty stunning addtion to Logic.

I agree that little has been done to change the workflow of the app, but to be honest, I think people really like the way Logic works..so..

I suppose I could think of a list of things that bother me, but for some reason I always forget about those things. Perhaps I'm blinded by the plug-ins/DSP?

I'm surprised that Steinberg and MOTU haven't added more plug-ins to their apps. MOTU has some great plug-ins, but haven't added much over the years. Steinberg, well, I don't even know where to begin.. I wish they'd focus their efforts on creating better plug-ins/eq/compressors/instruments, etc.

michael
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Joined: 28 Sep 2002, 00:59
Location: Seattle
Contact:

Post by michael » 09 Sep 2004, 09:43

jaxx wrote: Thats an amusing statement. Looked like the stuff they showed at NAMM looked a lot more Apple like than previous Logic versions..
Because it looked grey compared to the gunmetal and army green colors it's been? I've been told that Apple is letting Emagic decide about these things, though I'm sure Steve Jobs thinking it was fugly wil affect the app! The instruments looked exactly like every other plug they do, not a bad thing IMO.
Hey, also speaking about the Logic 6 upgrade, didn't you like Space Designer? I thought that was a pretty stunning addtion to Logic.

Look at the shear amount of features that were given to the consumer in Logic 5, things that you had no clue they would include later, like the update to the EXS, and tons of little things, all free. Space Designer is a paid upgrade, this is what I was talking about in concern to Apple's takeover.
I agree that little has been done to change the workflow of the app, but to be honest, I think people really like the way Logic works..so..
Exactly, Logic is Emagic's baby, and Apple bought it because they like it the way it is.

I suppose I could think of a list of things that bother me, but for some reason I always forget about those things. Perhaps I'm blinded by the plug-ins/DSP?
Multiple soft instruments in, or at least a way to switch soft instruments that doesn't require surgical precision to prevent Logic from deactivating the midi on your hardware instruments. This is #1 to me. #2 would be a way to use Logic in a live situation that didn't seem clunky.

I'm surprised that Steinberg and MOTU haven't added more plug-ins to their apps. MOTU has some great plug-ins, but haven't added much over the years. Steinberg, well, I don't even know where to begin.. I wish they'd focus their efforts on creating better plug-ins/eq/compressors/instruments, etc.

I'm an ex fan of the concept of integrated plugs, I would love to use the DSP friendly EXS24mkII in Live 4, but I'm not about to go out and buy Logic Express just to have it.
Also, though all the integrated plugs are nice, I would love to have the option NOT to buy them, and just buy the new features of the sequencer. Since Logic sucks in Live situations IMO, I'm importing work into Live 4.
It would be nice to have the use of tools like Altiverb on occasion, but it becomes impossible to justify buying Altiverb, when I could rewire into Logic, color a track with Space Designer, record it, then import that track into Live..... Blarrrrgh! These are all the reasons I stopped using Reason, (odd statement?), Reason doesn't allow you to change patterns from your host in rewire mode, so the Matrix and ReDrum have to be exported as midi, or you can use the Reason sequencer....
Logic is great, but it doesn't play well with others, and it's really not set up well for using in a lIve situation.
DP7, Live 8 Suite

Rogue
Site Supporter
Posts: 465
Joined: 28 Dec 2002, 08:34

Post by Rogue » 09 Sep 2004, 10:24

michael wrote:Logic is great, but it doesn't play well with others
hey you nicked that from me:
http://www.osxaudio.com/forums/viewtopi ... c&start=15
do that again and I'll sue your ass ;-)
Toontrack Crew Member

Killmaster
Posts: 89
Joined: 11 Mar 2003, 21:18

Post by Killmaster » 09 Sep 2004, 10:26

tracktion for me...

Dragonwind
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 May 2003, 06:05

Post by Dragonwind » 09 Sep 2004, 10:30

Can I change my vote from SX to DP now? :-)

jaxx
Posts: 18
Joined: 18 Jul 2002, 14:40
Location: San Francisco, CA

Post by jaxx » 09 Sep 2004, 10:39

There's only one app well suited for Live performance, and of course, that's Live.

I tried using Touch Tracks in Logic for live performance. That was amusing, but not quite inuitive or really powerful enough for me.

have you used that before?


Does anyone here use Cubase to perform live? I'm curious how their new pattern based sequencing features will effect live performance.

Cubase SX 3 looks pretty interesting. I think I'm going to get the update.

cerberus
Posts: 554
Joined: 30 Dec 2002, 12:09
Location: Dogpatch, USA
Contact:

Post by cerberus » 09 Sep 2004, 10:57

Dragonwind wrote:Can I change my vote from SX to DP now? :-)
Sydney is not in Florida, so I think not.

=
jaxx wrote:There's only one app well suited for Live performance, and of course, that's Live.
But DP is well suited for live Performance !...(only one app is well suited for performing with and that's: Performer); especially when external MIDI devices are considered.

=

Touch Tracks...
Like the Cubase IPS, so very powerful, but development on these particular features seems to have stopped since the '90s.


cerberus
Image
"It's quite scary actually, they seem to have nailed it, haven't they?"

asfdzxc
Posts: 1
Joined: 16 Sep 2004, 18:40

Post by asfdzxc » 16 Sep 2004, 18:53

Maybe a bit off topic: what DAW is the oldest that runs on OS X? i.e. something that would run on an iBook g3 900 VERY FAST bcs it was designed for a B&W g3 tower. EXCLUDING Logic bcs Logic 5 still costs too much. jea!

illovich
Posts: 3
Joined: 17 Mar 2003, 11:55
Contact:

Post by illovich » 16 Sep 2004, 19:05

I'm still locked into ProTools LE, and after recording last weekend with a digi002, I'm not sure I'm unhappy. Of course, my band is fairly anti-post, so what was really important was getting the sound right as it went in, and I was happily surprised that the digi002 had no trouble tracking to a firewire hardrive with my powerbook g4 as the protools client.

I know people love to hate digidesign, but in all I've been pretty happy with their products. :twisted:

RMStudioWorks
Posts: 1
Joined: 19 Sep 2003, 01:17
Location: My House

Post by RMStudioWorks » 23 Sep 2004, 17:14

logic but close behind is live4


rm.

vanceg
Posts: 252
Joined: 14 Apr 2003, 11:35
Location: Seattle

Post by vanceg » 04 Oct 2004, 16:20

Id like to be able to vote for my top three. In order of prefrence, you know.

I don't love any of them - but I supposed I would say -

Nuendo
Protools
Live

(but for different reasons)

Of coruse, I will vote normally also.

V~

vanceg
Posts: 252
Joined: 14 Apr 2003, 11:35
Location: Seattle

Re: Melodyne

Post by vanceg » 04 Oct 2004, 16:26

jaxx wrote:Is there anything better than Melodyne for pitch/time manipulation? I mean, anything that sounds better? Are there plug-ins which do similar types of things but are higher quality? Or is Melodyne the top dog?
Dang it! I can't find it right now, but didn't i see an announcement on OSX audio that there was another company coming out with a piece of software that was a lot like Melodyne (but WAY cheaper).

Hmmmm. Just a heads up.

OT - V~

cerberus
Posts: 554
Joined: 30 Dec 2002, 12:09
Location: Dogpatch, USA
Contact:

Post by cerberus » 12 Oct 2004, 22:07

jaxx wrote:... I'm trying to decide if Cubase SX 3 is worth the upgrade.

Is anyone here using it yet? ...
is it worth it?

I just bought SX3. It sounds fresh, clear and pristine. The faders are smoooth sounding, as on a nice Neve or SSL... not like any other software mixer I've heard.


cerberus
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"It's quite scary actually, they seem to have nailed it, haven't they?"

Grigri64
Posts: 1
Joined: 22 Aug 2004, 16:57
Location: Swiss

Post by Grigri64 » 15 Oct 2004, 13:51

For me, DP get my vote but where can I vote? No button?

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