Everyone should see Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 911&quo

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Aleatoric
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Everyone should see Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 911&quo

Post by Aleatoric » 26 Jun 2004, 17:18

Just saw it, blew me away. I think it is a really important, beautiful and informative film and everybody should see it no matter where you stand.
Last edited by Aleatoric on 26 Jun 2004, 19:37, edited 1 time in total.

djfreak
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Oh Yea

Post by djfreak » 26 Jun 2004, 17:40

Go and see it for sure. Bush is still going to win I'm afraid but in that San Francisco theatre last night the energy in the place was so on fire it actually gave me hope for a minute. Too bad we live in an insulated bubble here.

Some of the emotional stuff bordered on liberal propaganda but overall that is a must-see for sure. It will be out on DVD just in time for the election too. Smart.

We'll be reviewing it on "Common Sense" on Beathustler Radio this Tuesday June 29th at 7PM PST. Don't worry there won't be any spoilers in the review. Well, not too many.

-Evan

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Re: Oh Yea

Post by parasitk » 26 Jun 2004, 18:14

djfreak wrote:Bush is still going to win I'm afraid
bite your tongue!
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blumpy
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Good points if true.

Post by blumpy » 26 Jun 2004, 18:28

Michael Moore has made some very good points in his other films. More often than not, he stretches the truth. While entertaining, I would not call them accurate. Just dramatic. Calling a Moore film informative without checking the facts yourself is ignorant.

Look at Roger and Me. GM kills thousands of jobs in Flint MI. Why because the CEO wanted to save money and hates Flint. Real reason, because he wanted to save jobs by saving his company. The Japanese car manufactures were killing GM because they could make cars cheaper. Unions force higher wages. And in my opinion way too high. Moore wanted to interview the CEO Jack Nassar?. He declined. Why? Because he already gave a reason! Moore never put the reason in his film. So, Moore just followed him around to make him look like an ass because the difficult decision destroyed his hometown. The only message I got from that film was not to by land in Flint.

I'm not saying that he's full of shit. I am saying that if you want informative, it's going to have to be cold, slow, and boring. What the film intends to document could not possibly be explain in under 3 hours. It is instead a documentary of Moore fighting for his agenda.

I say, grabsome Michael Moore audio and edit the lines together, see if your friends can get a clear picture of what he is saying. Because that is what he does to everyone else.

Does he mention in the film what Clinton did to prevent further attacks? There were two on his watch. An first attempt at the Towers and the destroyer on the coast of Yemen. He claimed that he could get Bin Laden, publically!!!! But not through legal means. So instead getting Bin Laden illegally and lying, he decided it would be best to lie about a blowjob in court.

Does Moore mention that Iraq shot at our planes in the no-fly zone. That alone is an act of war. Yet nothing was done about it. Not much of a threat, but they didn't adhere to the treaty that they signed to stop the war maybe the war should have continued afterwards. Oh wait, it did.

There are definately many reasons to get Bush out of office. The Christian right, abortion laws, environmental laws. But Moore is not privilege to classified documents. Hell, Russian intelligence just recently said that Hussian thought what Bin Laden did was a great idea, and he wanted to do attacks himself. Of course the White House was privy this information before starting the war. Moore however, was not before making his film.

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Re: Good points if true.

Post by homershines » 26 Jun 2004, 20:12

blumpy wrote:Michael Moore has made some very good points in his other films. More often than not, he stretches the truth. While entertaining, I would not call them accurate. Just dramatic. Calling a Moore film informative without checking the facts yourself is ignorant.
I guess that's one thing that could arise from the brouhaha of this film: A discussion about the truth, the media and what we do and don't get on a daily basis. Hell, sometimes, I even have to agree with Pat Robertson. He has access to footage that I may on see on my regular new programs.

At this point, it seems that anyone who doesn't stretch the truth just isn't a good salesman.

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Re: Good points if true.

Post by crscheid » 26 Jun 2004, 20:15

blumpy wrote: There are definately many reasons to get Bush out of office. The Christian right, abortion laws, environmental laws. But Moore is not privilege to classified documents. Hell, Russian intelligence just recently said that Hussian thought what Bin Laden did was a great idea, and he wanted to do attacks himself. Of course the White House was privy this information before starting the war. Moore however, was not before making his film.
I agree. The tough battle I'm having to fight internally is whether or not to have someone in office who really irks me when it comes to the Christian Right, abortion laws, freedom of speech, etc .... or someone who can follow through in a touch situation. I loved "Bowling for Columbine" but Michael Moore's newest is a bit tought to swallow once you start digging into the facts. I suppose these are battles we can fight at home though. :?

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Re: Oh Yea

Post by MurdockScott » 26 Jun 2004, 20:32

djfreak wrote:Go and see it for sure. Bush is still going to win I'm afraid but in that San Francisco theatre last night the energy in the place was so on fire it actually gave me hope for a minute. Too bad we live in an insulated bubble here.
So here is the good news... I attended a sold out show in Dallas last night and My brother-in-law attended a sold out show in.... Lubbock! The crowd last night was cheering and crying, so even in Texas it is being seen by a LOT of fired up people.

I take Mr. Moore's work with a grain of salt, But I have to admit I'm a fan. The guy has big ones! I don't think I could stand up to several secret service agents that just HAPPENED to show up on location to gather information about what I was doing! lol

Go see it and make up your own mind about the information presented. However you personally see it, you will have some deep feelings... I can pretty much guarantee that.

Doc.

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Post by michael » 26 Jun 2004, 21:05

You know what? I was going to write this big long essay on why GWB is a turd etc. but really I would love it if there was on forum I could go to where we don't have to talk politics.

Sorry, but I'm very left wing, basically an anarchist, and GWB makes me ill. In some ways I seriously wonder whether evil based on a harsh outlook on life ( Saddam ) is actually worse than evil based on ignorance, ( GWB )..

but I digress, I'm not touching this one any more. :arrow:
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Post by frackyfreak » 26 Jun 2004, 21:32

michael wrote:You know what? I was going to write this big long essay on why GWB is a turd etc. but really I would love it if there was on forum I could go to where we don't have to talk politics.
agreed, with the upcoming election everything around us (conversations/media) will be (and already is) saturated with politics/polarizing opinions.

i say keep osxaudio pure, don't politicize (on) it! :-)

(so we can relax, and space out gazing at the cool blue... ahhh)
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Saw it. Loved it.

Post by jbessom » 26 Jun 2004, 22:29

Sure, Moore infuses his political opinion in his documentaries along with the facts. BUT - they ARE facts. He could not afford for them not to be. Every right wing nut with a lawyer would be all over his ass. I think it's a lesser evil kind of situation with the democrats. He omits bad things about them because hey, we have to elect someone! And nobody in their right mind could see this film and re-elect Bush. Worst president EVER.

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Post by Aleatoric » 26 Jun 2004, 22:33

I think the film speaks for itself, I recommend that everyone in the world see it.

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Re: Good points if true.

Post by buddhabelly » 26 Jun 2004, 22:35

blumpy wrote: There are definately many reasons to get Bush out of office. The Christian right, abortion laws, environmental laws. But Moore is not privilege to classified documents. Hell, Russian intelligence just recently said that Hussian thought what Bin Laden did was a great idea, and he wanted to do attacks himself. Of course the White House was privy this information before starting the war. Moore however, was not before making his film.
Bullshit. Bush is privy to the right information. He just doesn't know what to do with it, whether it fits his agenda or not.

As it stands now with the results we're getting out of Iraq, the lack of evidence that the country was doing anything untoward to us, I would take any info coming from the administration with a grain of salt.

The real message of this film is not how wrong, stupid or whatever Bush and crew are, but the terrible human cost to EVERYONE on both sides.

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Post by cerberus » 27 Jun 2004, 11:43

I don't know if this clip is in the film:

Bush Letterman Outtake

..but ... the truth is out there anyway, whether or not you agree with Moore's politics or his style.

·····> Farenheit 911 Trailer ...hosted by the good people at apple.com ... Thank you Apple !

The judges at Cannes seemed to like the film; so perhaps it is worth checking out on artistic merit alone.


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Mind-Over-Midi
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Re: Saw it. Loved it.

Post by Mind-Over-Midi » 27 Jun 2004, 15:14

jbessom wrote:Sure, Moore infuses his political opinion in his documentaries along with the facts. BUT - they ARE facts. He could not afford for them not to be. Every right wing nut with a lawyer would be all over his ass. I think it's a lesser evil kind of situation with the democrats. He omits bad things about them because hey, we have to elect someone! And nobody in their right mind could see this film and re-elect Bush. Worst president EVER.
Agreed! My girlfriend and I saw the film last night. Brilliant! Moore has his opinion and he makes it quite evident but the the images and the facts speak for themselves. Hell Bush speaks for himself! I can see why the Republican supporters tried to block the release of this film. I can see why they are now going to court to try to block advertising for this film. They don't want you to see this movie and once you do see it, you'll know why. Worst president EVER? Agreed, even worse than R. Reagan and George W. H. Bush! :evil:

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Just one minute, truth-crusaders...

Post by masterhiggins » 28 Jun 2004, 09:04

Mind-Over-Midi wrote:
jbessom wrote: He could not afford for them not to be. Every right wing nut with a lawyer would be all over his ass.
Nice try. Actually, he commonly uses a tactic known as "lying by withholding information". That way, he can get away with all kinds of shit w/o worrying of legal implications. Because technically, he's NOT LYING. What a bunch of crap.
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