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Everyone should see Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 911&quo
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Trekkie_2k4
- Posts: 7
- Joined: 13 May 2004, 15:40
There is no diplomacy. You absolutely cannont deal with terrorism. The only way to stop it is to kill it. Excuse me, but wars are the way to go if you want true freedom. If we didn't go to war now, we would have had another 9/11 on our hands because those terrorist ain't gonna stop until every last one of us is dead. Look at nazi germany and all the other past wars. Those countries are free now and are enjoying a more prosperous lifestyle now. I've seen on TV how many of the women in Iraq and Afghanistan are happy that we helped to free them from the tyranic rule they were under.But look at the world .. where is the diplomacy? Where are these "wise" people having learned from history that wars arent the way to go? where´s the progress when it comes to this?
Michael Moore is an uneducated man who obviously does not enjoy the personal freedoms that he has at the moment. Otherwise he would be supporting Bush for the effort in DEFENDING us from the terrorists. Yes, President Bush is not perfect, but he is at least doing the right and honorable thing by getting rid of these dictators.
"If you want freedom, you're gonna have to fight for it."
trekkie .. the point you gave is known, and there are quite a lot of people thinking like you.
But: Where´s the questioning of WHY the whole situation is so damn messed up?
Where are these people representing our governments saying "okay, if there are problems we should contact them" ..
thats what makes me sad: it seems as if noone wants to talk.
And by saying this i dont only mean the western world .. its "them" as well.
Its OUR mistake .. the mistake of both sides, and thats a shame.
I am so tired of all this "they" and "we" .. pfffff
putte
But: Where´s the questioning of WHY the whole situation is so damn messed up?
Where are these people representing our governments saying "okay, if there are problems we should contact them" ..
thats what makes me sad: it seems as if noone wants to talk.
And by saying this i dont only mean the western world .. its "them" as well.
Its OUR mistake .. the mistake of both sides, and thats a shame.
I am so tired of all this "they" and "we" .. pfffff
putte
trekkie, i am curious if you saw the movie. . . .
furthermore, many would argue that Americans are not exempt from the label of terrorists.
thirdly, what are you smoking? Bush is doing the honorable thing? what is honorable about what he is doing? you say ridding the world of dictators....you mean ridding the world of the dictators that are not in the best interest of the United States.
perhaps it is in the best interest of this country to try to establish a more solid relationship with the other countries of the world; I personally hate bullies. this situation in Iraq is not helping a thing; it is only provoking greater hatred towards America, and perhaps rightfully so. this american macho kill or be killed attitude is pathetic and disgusting ; and the film (far from perfect) brings up an interesting point; that perhaps the news media (with George Bush's hands deep in the pockets)uses our fears to fuel the greed of the men in power. the elite.
furthermore, many would argue that Americans are not exempt from the label of terrorists.
thirdly, what are you smoking? Bush is doing the honorable thing? what is honorable about what he is doing? you say ridding the world of dictators....you mean ridding the world of the dictators that are not in the best interest of the United States.
perhaps it is in the best interest of this country to try to establish a more solid relationship with the other countries of the world; I personally hate bullies. this situation in Iraq is not helping a thing; it is only provoking greater hatred towards America, and perhaps rightfully so. this american macho kill or be killed attitude is pathetic and disgusting ; and the film (far from perfect) brings up an interesting point; that perhaps the news media (with George Bush's hands deep in the pockets)uses our fears to fuel the greed of the men in power. the elite.
Re: Just one minute, truth-crusaders...
Can you give some examples to back your statement up "master"?masterhiggins wrote:Mind-Over-Midi wrote:Nice try. Actually, he commonly uses a tactic known as "lying by withholding information". That way, he can get away with all kinds of shit w/o worrying of legal implications. Because technically, he's NOT LYING. What a bunch of crap.jbessom wrote: He could not afford for them not to be. Every right wing nut with a lawyer would be all over his ass.
For the record, the US was a close ally of Saddam DURING the period he was gassing the Kurds, etc. There's a great picture in F911 of Rumself grinning like an idiot shaking loyal ally Saddam's hand sometime int heearly-mid 80's, the period he was commiting the worst of his atrocities.
Fact is, USA has a long history backing fascist governments. Either our government does it outright, or our business leaders do it slightly more clandestinely (like Ford, Prescott Bush, etc. backed Hitler leading up to, and during, WWII). So the rest of the world sees our hypocrisy, and calls us on it.
Fact is, Iraq has NOTHING to do with the 911 attacks. That was Afghanistan, a country we gave $43 million to in the months leading up to the 911 attacks because they were our great allies in the war against drugs. How's that for directly funding an Islamo-fascist regime? What about our constant support of the House of Saud in Saudi Arabia, another fascist, authoritarian, dictatorial regime? Again, hypocrisy. I could go on and on, but most educated folks already know this stuff, and most ignorant folks are too narrow-minded to even consider looking at another point of view.
Another fact: Saddam was clearly not only telling the truth to the UN weapons inspectors that were on the ground in Iraq leading up to the war, but was even destroying weapons systems that did NOT violate our sanctions, such as those missiles that didn't even go outside the range we declared his missiles could fly. But that seems to all be forgotten in retrospect.
To all of the "patriotic" Americans who support the war, I say one thing: Go and enlist, and fight the good fight, if it's so important. When the troops you run into in Iraq tell you the war is full of crap and pointless, and then the USA extends your tour of duty by an indefinite number of months, and then you get an arm blown off, and then you come home and experience symptoms of depleted uranium dust exposure, go ahead and tell me it was a good fight, because of alal the weapons of mass distruction we found (zero), and the Iraqi terrorists we stopped (zero, but we created tens of thousands -- now that was a good idea).
To the non-Americans who read this board, I say one thing: Be VERY afraid of the USA. I now imagine what things might have been like in Nazi Germany leading up to the "takeover" of the Nazis (who were elected into power after all). A very good number of Americans are VERY ignorant, and very conservative, to the degree the Taliban is. We also have enough nukes to turn this planet into a wasteland many times over. Yes -- be VERY afraid. Our education system is so pathetic, there is simply no chance that we will begin to turn around and realise the folly of our ways. Most Americans are just too dumb, and do not possess the mental skills to understand what is going on in the world around them.
It is a VERY sad and depressing time to live int his country. God help us.
Fact is, USA has a long history backing fascist governments. Either our government does it outright, or our business leaders do it slightly more clandestinely (like Ford, Prescott Bush, etc. backed Hitler leading up to, and during, WWII). So the rest of the world sees our hypocrisy, and calls us on it.
Fact is, Iraq has NOTHING to do with the 911 attacks. That was Afghanistan, a country we gave $43 million to in the months leading up to the 911 attacks because they were our great allies in the war against drugs. How's that for directly funding an Islamo-fascist regime? What about our constant support of the House of Saud in Saudi Arabia, another fascist, authoritarian, dictatorial regime? Again, hypocrisy. I could go on and on, but most educated folks already know this stuff, and most ignorant folks are too narrow-minded to even consider looking at another point of view.
Another fact: Saddam was clearly not only telling the truth to the UN weapons inspectors that were on the ground in Iraq leading up to the war, but was even destroying weapons systems that did NOT violate our sanctions, such as those missiles that didn't even go outside the range we declared his missiles could fly. But that seems to all be forgotten in retrospect.
To all of the "patriotic" Americans who support the war, I say one thing: Go and enlist, and fight the good fight, if it's so important. When the troops you run into in Iraq tell you the war is full of crap and pointless, and then the USA extends your tour of duty by an indefinite number of months, and then you get an arm blown off, and then you come home and experience symptoms of depleted uranium dust exposure, go ahead and tell me it was a good fight, because of alal the weapons of mass distruction we found (zero), and the Iraqi terrorists we stopped (zero, but we created tens of thousands -- now that was a good idea).
To the non-Americans who read this board, I say one thing: Be VERY afraid of the USA. I now imagine what things might have been like in Nazi Germany leading up to the "takeover" of the Nazis (who were elected into power after all). A very good number of Americans are VERY ignorant, and very conservative, to the degree the Taliban is. We also have enough nukes to turn this planet into a wasteland many times over. Yes -- be VERY afraid. Our education system is so pathetic, there is simply no chance that we will begin to turn around and realise the folly of our ways. Most Americans are just too dumb, and do not possess the mental skills to understand what is going on in the world around them.
It is a VERY sad and depressing time to live int his country. God help us.
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Trekkie_2k4
- Posts: 7
- Joined: 13 May 2004, 15:40
I saw enough of it to know how disgusting and terribly biased it was at looking at the war. You always need to look at both sides when presenting a case like that.trekkie, i am curious if you saw the movie. . . .
Who are we terrorizing? I don't see anyone fearing us. As a matter of fact, they thank us for helping free their country! Now they don't have to constantly be tortured and live in fear.furthermore, many would argue that Americans are not exempt from the label of terrorists.
Nope! Dictators that are not in the best interest of the world. If you haven't noticed, Great Britian along with several other countries have joined in our plite for freedom.you say ridding the world of dictators....you mean ridding the world of the dictators that are not in the best interest of the United States.
We have established solid relationships. Look at the alliances we have with many of the countries today. The only countries we aren't working well with are the middle eastern countries, and it's not because we don't want to work with them. I hate bullies too my friend, but we most certainly are not bullying anyone.perhaps it is in the best interest of this country to try to establish a more solid relationship with the other countries of the world; I personally hate bullies. this situation in Iraq is not helping a thing; it is only provoking greater hatred towards America, and perhaps rightfully so.
Ahem, the situation in Iraq has helped greatly. Take a look at this CNN article.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/06/ ... index.html
I don't like war either, but if we don't fight back, then we die from the thousands of terrorists out there who want to kill us just because we are Americans.this american macho kill or be killed attitude is pathetic and disgusting
I emplore you to educate yourself more thoroughly next time before you start spitting out information that isn't too accurate. You might want to take a gander at Sean Hannity's program. It does a world of good.
you say fight back.... but we are not fighting back with iraq because they had not been attacking us until we started dropping bombs and tanking through their homes.
cnn is definetly not the final word in politiical analysis.
and does that mean you walked out on the micheal moore film? or have you seen pieces of it on the news. what did you mean by you saw enough? you probably didnt stay to the second half when it showed the look of pure terror in the eyes of old iragi women who lost their families to American strikes, or you probably didnt see the terror in the eyes of many of the soldiers who are indefinetly stranded fighting in a land for uknown reasons. if you want to believe bullshit bush rhetoric, then you are right. we are defending ourselves against the evil-doers (that we helped supply and train by the way)
cnn is definetly not the final word in politiical analysis.
and does that mean you walked out on the micheal moore film? or have you seen pieces of it on the news. what did you mean by you saw enough? you probably didnt stay to the second half when it showed the look of pure terror in the eyes of old iragi women who lost their families to American strikes, or you probably didnt see the terror in the eyes of many of the soldiers who are indefinetly stranded fighting in a land for uknown reasons. if you want to believe bullshit bush rhetoric, then you are right. we are defending ourselves against the evil-doers (that we helped supply and train by the way)
I was hoping for a wink somewhere in there but alas, no such luck. good luck preaching in here, but when you are talking aboutTrekkie_2k4 wrote:I emplore you to educate yourself more thoroughly next time before you start spitting out information that isn't too accurate. You might want to take a gander at Sean Hannity's program. It does a world of good.
"who are we terrorizing? I don't see anyone fearing us"
then good luck spotting them starving aids infected kids that suffer because the US stopped supporting hospitals that allow for abortion. good luck counting the dead civilians in iraq, afghanistan, palestine, israel or wherever really. just not on your front lawn in your subdivision. that one's pretty safe. I can't be bothered to pull my conversational registers and actually argue on topic about US policies but if it is not blatantly obvious by now then there is denial. read canadian news, read the BBC page, read alternet.org, DEFINITELY read http://www.thewarincontext.org but most importantly READ, don't watch (fox).
-- http://www.regicide.org --
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